los angeles coliseum. it will arrive there tomorrow night sometime around 8:30 or 9:00, as long as there's no significant delays tomorrow night. >> walking along with the shuttle. what a picture that is. thanks very, very much. lisa sylvester is watching it along with me as well. unfortunately, we're out of time. >> such a treat. you saw the crowds out there, too. >> erin burnett "outfront" >> erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. -- captions by vitac -- www.vitac.com "outfront" next, the evolving story of who knew what and when about the deadly terrorist attack in libya. a day after we heard testimony that the state department denied requests for additional security. we heard this from the vice president. >> well, we weren't told wanted more security. we did not know they wanted more security. >> doesn't add up. plus, new problems r the secret service after an agent is found passed out, allegedly drunk, just hours after the

president left a campaign rally and the ipad may be getting smaller, but will its price tag be small enough? let's go "outfront." good evening, everyone, i'm erin burnett. tonight, under the bus. did the vice president throw the state department under a campaign bus last night when asked about requests from american diplomats for additional security in libya? here's what he said. >> they wanted more security there. >> well, we weren't told wanted more security. we did not know they wanted more security and by the way, at the time, we were told exactly we said exactly what the intelligence community told us that they knew. that was the assessment. >> that was also what joe biden got the most negative ratings of the entire debate among the undecided voters i was with last night.

now, why was this comment so controversial? well, because those voters alreawere still wondering why the request for more security in libya was turned down. a security officer in libya was questioned about that very issue this week. >> you were asking for more assets, more resources, more personnel. that was denied, but the state department went back and reclassified it as more dangerous, the danger pay therefore increased. they didn't sell you the we didn't have resources, congress just cut your budget, they gave you an increase because the danger was rising, correct? >> that's correct. we received a danger pay increase. >> so, when joe biden said we knew nothing about this request for security, who is the we? well, jay carney, the white house spokesman in a white house briefing today cleared that up. >> he was speaking directly for himself and for the president. he meant the white house. >> so, if the president and the

vice president, the white house, didn't know about the security request, then who is to blame for the security lapse in libya on september 11th? jay carney again. >> i just want to be clear. it was never in the presidential daily brief or anything like that. >> i'm not going to sit and talk to you about this. >> the detail. >> no, i'm not. i'm saying matters of how many personnel are assigned to embassies and consulates and other diplomats facilities are not decided at the white house. they're decideded at the state department. >> they are decided at the state department. is it possible that the president and vice president did not know about the request for more security prior to the attack in ben gghazi? the answer is yes. but passing the buck may not add up. for two reasons. first, in a press release on september 10th, the white house said and i'll quote them. the president heard from key national security principles on

our preparedness of our security posture on the eve of september 11th, to protect the american people both at home and abroad. now, maybe consulates don't make the cut for this kind of briefing, but maybe if they're in a middle eastern country in chaos where officers have detailed incidents in the past 15 months, they should. this second reason is this. see that? that was harry truman's desk. the buck stops here. it was a sign that sat on his desk. the state department isn't same administration, so where does the buck stop? pj crawley and peter brooks, gentlemen, really appreciate your taking the time. pj, i wanted to start with you on this whole issue of joe biden saying we and then jay carney specifying that meant himself and the president. and saying that it was the state department that would have made that call. what do you think about the vice president separating himself

from the state department and the fourth person in line to the presidency? >> well, i think jay carney also said that ultimately, the responsibility for everything that happened in government starts with the commander in chief and works its way down. barack obama's responsible, joe biden's responsible, hillary clinton's responsible and so forth. as to the decision itself, the the vice president was stating a fact. that normal routine matters in terms of how you balance the level of security at 100 plus diplomatic posts around the world, those decisions are made day-to-day, week to week at the state department. so, i don't see a contradiction between what you've said and what the vice president said. >> you didn't think it at all strange last night when asked well, i didn't know anything about it? >> i understood completely this would not be a operational detail that would necessarily come to the white house or to the national security council unless there is a very

significant policy issue or dispute. >> peter, first ambassador killed in 33 years in this line of duty in this country. where does the buck stop? >> it should stop in the oval office. i agree in the sense they may not have been briefed with it, but it would have been nice if the vice president would have said last nht, i understand decisions may have been made at a lower level, but i'm the vice president of the united states and i take responsibility for what happened in libya. >> and is the white house backed in oo a corner here? if they keep saying the state department's responsible, if you keep saying that and it keeps turning out maybe they made the wrong decision, then don't they need to hold someone accountable for that mistake? that somebody needs to go. >> in fairness, this is something we are still investigating even after we say that this was a terrorist attack

and by a group that had been planning this for some time. we still don't know if this group acting on its on or with support from the outside. the contemporaneous don't understand that we have suffered the deaths of four diplomats in libya relatively contemporane s contemporaneously to the fact that we have suffered 2,000 casualties in afghanistan. should approve that there was a link to the consulate bombing in libya and obviously, we've seen and understand the link between the taliban and al-qaeda core in afghanistan. this is part of the same struggle. now, at some point in time once this is fully investigated by the fbi and within the state department, you know, should judgments had proven to be misguided, for example, i think we can say that the security was inadequate based on the threat we saw emerge september 11th, then there may well will accountability in terms of

decisions made within the state department. but it's not there yet. >> peter, it seemed to me, talking to undecided voters, they seem pretty shocked by this. this was in virginia where a lot of people have friends or themselves have served in tough places like the middle east. they say how is it possible that on september 11th in a country like libya, the ambassador just went to a consulate, but didn't have security? how the heck did this happen? >> yeah, i tell you what, i don't how it happened either. it needs to be investigated, but the administration's slow rolling this. almost five weeks since this happeneded and there are more questions than answers. it's my sense that the last thing this administration wanted to say in the aftermath of this terrible tragedy, that american sovereign territory had been attacked by an al-qaeda affiliated group on the 11th anniversary of 9/11. that's the bottom line here and i think they're going to go everything they can including

throwing the state department under the bus to prevent tha from being said and the only time they're coming forward with these things is when congress investigates it. the only time they really starteded calling it a terrorist attack was after the director of a terrorism center was questioned. i think it was joe lieberman of connecticut who asked him, then the night before the big hearing in the house, the state department says oh, by the way, almost five weeks later, we realize that it wasn't a demonstration, but just an attack. >> and i want to, speaking of the politics of this, mitt romney brought up the issue on the campaign trial about what joe biden said last night. here he is. >> because the vice president directly contradicted the sworn testimony of state department officials. he's doubling down on denial. and we need to understand exactly what happened. as opposed to just having people brush this aside. >> pj, the secretary of state, the first time since october

3rd, came out and spoke today. why the silence? >> look, i'm trying to, i'm struggling with what peter just said here. these things are being investigated and the fact that you have the head of the national count terrorism center come forward within five days and clarify this was in the judgment of the administration and intelligence professionals an attack, that is being as forthcoming as you can be based on your understanding of the facts at the time. we're now only 30 days after the attack. i remember back to the previous administration, it took them more than a year before the analysis was completed that said you know, our intelligence judgment regardi weapons of mass destruction in iraq turned out to be wrong. so i think you've got to give this process a little bit of time to emerge to where you have a full understanding of what happened. who is responsible. why they did it and then we can let the chips fall where they

may. >> all right, well thank you very much, both of you. we appreciate it. our focus on that issue will continue as well. during last night's debate, you probably noticed the vice president, he's a very -- he certainly does look like he's had botox. he made faces, laughed, interrupted. plus, paul ryan blames mitt romney's tax plan adds up. even says it's been done before. a fact check coming up. and a teenage girl bullied posted a desperate cry on the internet. just a month later, she's dead. ♪ [ male announcer ] how do you make 70,000 trades a second... ♪ reach one customer at a time? ♪ or help doctors turn billions of bytes of shared information... ♪

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throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multi-vitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has more of 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. our second story "outfront," excuse the interrupt. it started last night. republicans were up in arms over what they say was a rude vice president biden. >> it's a plan i put together with a prominent democratic senator from -- >> there's not one democrat who

endorses -- >> our partner is a democrat from oregon. that's ou it's going all around america. look -- >> that's not how it's going. it's going down. >> two-minute answers. >> it is mathematically possible. it's been done before. it's what we're proposing. >> it has never been done before. >> it's been done a couple of times before. jack kennedy lowered -- >> oh, now, you're jack kennedy. >> mr. vice president -- i know you're under a lot of duress to make up for the lost round, but i think people will be better served if we don't keep interrupting each other. >> the rnc says the score was 82 from biden and just a handful from ryan. good to see both of you. i like the way you played together. i think it sort of captured a part of it. republicans were bouncing on this. they said it showed that joe biden was unhinged. in our focus group, it did not

go over well. but democrats seemed to be pretty happy about the joe biden they saw. >> that's right, erin. and clearly coming out of last week, democrats, let's just say, were completely demoralized from the first presidential debate. i think what joe biden was doing was really channelling the extra frustration that democrats felt every time that president obama did not take advantage of the wonderful opportunities and joe biden was making sure that he was going to take advantage and probably overly take advantage of every single opportunity that came his way and i got to say, it was exactly, judging from the reaction, it was exactly what the doctor for the democratic base ordered and he livered. >> and they wanted a guy to go into a bar fight. joe biden is not afraid of any kind of a bar fight, but it was not just the interruptions that the gop didn't like, but also frankly, that the focus group responded so. many took issue with biden's very expressive face.

>> it makes us more week. it projects weakness and when we look weak, our adversaries are more willing to test us. >> they say the military option is on the table. was it a good idea to borrow all this mey from countries like china. try to scare people from voting for you. different than this administration, we actually want to have big bipartisan agreements. we had these sanctions in place. it's in spite of their opposition. >> he has a beautiful smile. >> certainly true. erin, i think this debate was the gift that keeps on giving to both democrats and republicans. maria made a lot of great points. a lot of folks said we want a feistier obama. he doesn't want to seem on nogs. it's something where biden was able to be feisty without damaging the obama brand and someone with a cool temperment and republicans were able to say this guy, during a time the

national mood is somber and serious, looks like he's having an absolutely spectacular time while the foreign policy is in a tail spin of this administration. so for republicans, it seems hey, this guy is having the ride of his life, but is he having it at our expense? >> maria, some also made references to another debate. the last time we were counting things that happened in a debate was al gore and the -- obviously, the former bush white house press secretary tweeted last night, biden is at risk of having his laugh come across like gore's sighs. he should not it off. do you think he should knock it off? >> i don't and clearly, that is what republicans are wanting to spin and will continue to spin it that way and while i was watching it, i could have done a little bit less of the smirks and laughs, but judging from the

democratic base, it is exactly what they needed. if all they can pounce on is his demeanor and laughs as opposed to the substance, i think democrats are in a good place, but here's how i will describe it, erin. i think last night's debate was the political equivalent of the ink blot test where both democrats and republicans not only saw what they wanted to see, but they saw what they needed the see. >> and both sides are a winner. >> s talks about this motivating debates. what abo wt you need to win, which is so some of those people who areundecided? it seems to me, as evidenced by the swing we saw after the presidential debate, a lot of people who said they knew who they were voting for, didn't. >> it's evidence how soft support so s for both right now. when you're looking at biden's performance, part of the issue

is that martha raddatz is a foreign policy correspondent that asked questions that got very, very granular. other things that a lot of folks at home weren't following, so on that substance point, i think the affect of the two guys counts for a lot and i think a lot f people saw ryan as an earnest guy, holding his own more or less. was a bit shaky, but kept getting interrupted and shut down. so it's not just republicans who might see it that way, but other folks, midwestern folks, who like paul ryan's temperment and those count for a lot. >> "outfront" next, new trouble in the secret service. an agent arrested just hours after the president left a campaign stop and then apple. is apple afraid? very afraid. dea. think. drink coffee. design something totally original. do it again. that's good. call in the engineers. call in the car guys.

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our third story "outfront," the secret service has another embarrassment on its hands. overnight, one of is agents was found in miami passed out on the sidewalk. all this happened just hours

after president obama left town. dan, what can you tell us about the agent and what he was doing? >> his name aaron frances ingler. he is a member of the uniformed division. not one in a suit and tie and ear piece, but rather a uniformed police officer. they work perimeter protection for these events. the president was in miami for a big rally. they'll often scan people as they're going into events, but he was found by a police officer on a street corner in miami. he was arrested for disorderly intoxication for resisting arrest without violence and accord tog an affidavit which we obtained, the arresting officer said quote i observed the defendant with bloodshot eyes, a strong odor of alcoholic beverage emitting from his breath. he went on to describe how he

put him on his feet. he couldn't get up. he kept placing his arms around the officer. the officer asked him to stop and at some point, the arresting officer says he hit my face. he was eventually able to put him in handcuffs. the secret service says a review is underway, but this is getting a will the of attention because of the big scandal that happened in april. a lot of questions about the culture inside the u.s. secret service. >> dan, thank you and paul ryan compared his campaign's plan the cut taxes to kennedy. jfk. does the comparison add up? plus, she was bullied for months and cried out for help in a video she posted on the web and tonight, we learn she couldn't take it anymore. hahahaha! hooohooo, hahaha! this is awesome!

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welcome back to the second half of "outfront." we start with the stories we care about where we focus on our reporting from the front lines and we begin tonight with e space shuttle "endeavour." it's on its way t.o. california science center. it's not moving very fast.

it start it's only a 12-mile trip, but it's going to take two days to get there. it's pace, about 2 miles an hour. even more important, officials had to take down street lights and cut down trees. apparently, a lot of them. to make the move possible. the center for disease -- that's up from only 170 confirmed cases yesterday. the cdc also added to the states impacted. 14 have died. authorities say as many as 14,000 people could have received contaminated injections. u.n. security counsel has passed a resolution which gives mali and other countries to put troops on the ground to oust islamic extremists. the counsel will still have to

pass another to get the troops in. they warned the groups to cut off ties to organizations, particularly al-qaeda or else they'll face sanctions. an influx of extremists has driven half a million malians from their homes. we noticed a couple of pieces of good news on the u.s. economy. the read was a big jump. hit ago level we haven't seen since september of 2007, before the financial crisis and also, jpmorgan released its quarterly dimon said we believe the housing market has turned the corner. the comments from mr. dimon could be significant. it's been 435 days sibs is

country lost its top credit rating. the fourth year running it exceeded the trillion dollar mark. and now, our four story "outfron fourth story. jack kennedy and paul ryan. there are some things that are similar. both young, energetic, vibrant. paul ryan seems to think they have something this common, joe biden though, not so sure. in what you could say say is a vp tradition, this time, the issue was tacks. >> you can cut tax rates by 20% and still preserve these for middle class taxpayers -- >> not mathematically possible. >> it is. it's been done before. >> it has never been done before. >> it's been done a couple of times -- >> it has never -- >> reagan. >> oh, now, you're jack kennedy. >> ronald reagan. >> twitter was all a twitter about that. the line generated 275 tweets a minute.

kind of crazy. there's a noticeable reaction from the group of virginia undecided voters that i watched during the debate. you can see it blown up there at the bottom of the screen. but here's the problem. both kennedy and reagan were working in a different time and place, so to start with, when both kennedy and reagan took office, individual tax rates were not even in the ballpark of what we're dealing with now. they make france like like a low tax regime. kennedy's plan took the rate to 70% over a two-year period. lots of loopholes, but the growth argument, gdp rose during that time, but wasn't much when the economy was growing at a rate like china's, so they got a boost, but not much. as for reagan, his first big tax cut went into effect in 1981 and reduced the rate to 50%. over the first two years, the

economy did surge. that's impressive. year three though, not so impressive. today, the top marginal tax rate is at 30%. not like you're at 70 or 90. can rates really spur the romney ryan growth? bring in our guests to find out whether it's true. doug holtz eakin and zandy. forget the loophole. you would see the top rate go down to 38%. that's not really, certainly not a drop like jfk did or reagan did. can 35 to 28 really spark real gdp growth? >> i would agree we're in a different world, a better world. the thing they have in common is that these are permanent tax reforms. permanent changes have a much

bigger impact than do temporary targeted changes. makes sense. you get a tax cut per day, wouldn't make much of a difference. the te search also forced that notion. as a permanent change that illuminates uncertainties about the taxes. the second piece, there's this complexity that causes people to waste money with tax planning, lawyers. it leads you to waste business decisions on the base of taxes. it erodes the faith in the tax system. i think the combination of the permanence and getting businesses to focus are big for growth. >> i understand your point. i think that's a fair point, but mark, let me ask you, is it fair for paul ryano compare what he's proposing to what reagan and jfk did? >> for the reasons you gave, the

top rates were a lot higher under kennedy. close to 90% and 70% under reagan. the cut in the marginal rate was a lot bigger and we were in a different fiscal world. back in the early '60s, we were running budget surpluses. even in the early '80s, the budget deficit was a lot smaller. that's the key reason i'd be concerned. i think tax reform is a good idea. doug is right. we need to have tax reform, but we need tax reform that raises enough revenue to lower tax rates and also goes to reducing future budget deficit because if we don't get the deficits down, lower tax rates aren't going help us. >> and doug, do you think it's fair to say, romney ryan have been saying they think a 3% growth is reasonable. do you think it is? because for in of this math to work out and this whole argument everybody's having about whether they can cut taxes and close enough loopholes, they are counting on economic growth on being part of making up that

difference. will it? >> you can't say for sure because good tax policy does t matter. t not the only thing going on out there and you would have to have a displn palestinianed, economic policy. we have a serious threat to the economy from existed and projected debt. it is different from the era of reagan in that debt is not being driven by annual decisions made by congress, which are easy to change. if you want to have a successful road package, you can't just -- you have to pair it with entitlement reform. one more thing. little changes matter here. first 200 years of u.s. existence, it grew faster than the united kingdom. faster each year and in that time, we went from 13 colonies to the largest, most powerful economy on the planet and the united kingdom went from the largest power to something much smaller, so focusing on growth

is more important. >> let me play something here because it does all come down to the middle class when it comes to taxes and both sides have been trying to make that argument. whose tax plan is going to help the middle class or kill the middle class. here's the argument. >> there's been a study done cently that shows with all the spending he's plan ining and al the interest on the debt that's associated with that spending, that he's going to have to raise taxes on middle income americans again. >> the bipartisan group called the tax policy center made up of former bush and clinton economic experts, that's why they said that the romney ryan tax plan would in fact raise taxes on middle class families with a child an average of $2,000 a year. >> mark, i'm getting a little tired of hearing all the studies being referenced. >> i write those studies.

do we really know which side is right when everybody can cite a study? >> i think the tax policy center the very definitive. i think they do fabulous work and it's fair to say that under the romney plan as currently proposed, it will be very difficult to be deficit neutral and get away with not raising taxes on middle income househ d househol households. now, having said that, i'm sure governor romney would adjust his plan to make sure that doesn't happen. he probably scaled back his tax cuts to make sure taxes for middle income households wouldn't go up. the main beneficiaries are going to be high income households. >> unless loopholes get closed. >> well, even if the -- depends

on how they close them. >> that's the question. >> we're depending so much on loopholes here and it's a lot that have to be cut because it's a lot of revenue. we don't have any clarity with respect to what that means and if we're going to focus on that, we need more clarity as well. >> well, thanks very much to both of you. we'll have more on all the duelling studies out there. still to come, biden's -- paul ryan's mex mention of green port. sort of a strange little thing. we'll make sure you hear it and tonight, the internet is buzzing over apple news that could set the market on fire, but it seems that apple might be very afraid. p but she loved it so much... i told her it was homemade. everyone tells a little white lie now and then. but now she wants my recipe [ clears his throat ] [ softly ] she's right behind me isn't she? [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup. the distances aren't getting shorter.

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we're back with tonight's outer circle. tonight, we go canada where police are looking into the tragic death of a young girl who police say killed herself after posting an online confessional about being bullied. a canadian broadcasting corporation filed the story. >> the video is heartbreaking. >> a 15-year-old named amanda. she never speaks, but recounts

how she descended into depression and self-harm after taunts online. harassed to attacks at school. she uploaded it to youtube last month. yesterday, she took her own life. she couldn't escape her tor meanters. now, classmates are in disbelief. >> this has been going on for a very long time. >> school officials who knew about the bullying say they connected her with counselors. >> the district was aware of the video nafs postethat was posted supports were in place. >> condolences flooded facebook, where match up of amanda's ordeal played out. amanda posted a school project on cyber bullying, yet her online confessional mirrors similar stories of pain. tragically, she hoped her video would help others. now, youtube has pulled it and

counselors grapple with its legacy. >> awful story. those two words may sound very strange, but they were said last night. they were part of a tense moment during the debate. paul ryan was criticizing the administration for spending money on green energy, but biden hit back on the attack. here's the exchange. >> the vice president was in charge of overseeing this. $90 billion in green pork, the campaign contributors and special interest groups. >> sent me two letters saying by the way, can you send me some stimulus money for companies here in the state of wisconsin. we sent millions of dollars. >> you did ask for stimulus money. >> on two occasions, we advocated for applying for grants. it's what we do. we do that for all constituents. >> turns out biden was wrong.

he made at least four. that's a fact check i'm sure joe is really upset about. the rest of them, he probably wants to hear nothing about, but this one, he probably does. paul ryan has been criticizing green pork for a while, but had also asked for money to create green jobs. some might say this is practi l practical, others hypocritical. >> joe biden went right up to the trough and asked for his. the part of being a member of congress is requesting money for your constituents. on the one hand, he's got to provide for his constituents. on the other hand, when he hits the campaign trial, his open accusations of hypocrisy, also because here's a guy who spent his entire adult life working in government. it's a tricky line. >> so, how much does this hurt paul ryan? you might not want the stimulus, but when it happens, you've got

to go fight for your piece of it. does that sell or not? >> in general, i believe hypocrisy is the unforgivable sin, but this is understandable. people do get part of your job isn't just to be a policy wonk, but to fight for the rights of your constituents. >> last night, there was also the exchange about the letters and then joe biden said well, you can write me a letter when ever you want. but you have some of the letters. >> yes. we have four of the letters right here and look, they asked for -- >> are they written like you would write a letter to a friend? >> oh, no. >> not to a friend? >> this is not my friend, joe biden, give me some green pork. that's over lunch. now, this is simply a bureaucratic navigation, but writing a secretary of energy asking for these green jobs and stimulus money. the very stuff he hits on the campaign trial a lot.

he's hitting it on the campaign trial. attacking the stimulus. attacking green jobs but in these letters clearly asking for his own share of green pork when he had the opportunity. >> and what's your bottom line verdict? you think this is understandable for voters? >> i think they need to understand this is part of the congressman's job, but if he's going it never benefits small businesses, talking about green pork, green jobs, how the stimulus was a failure, he had to know these letters were out there. that opens him up to accusations of hypocrisy or ideological inconsistency. friend might have been the most annoying word of the debate last night. just my take. "outfront" next, he's only 12 years old but already caught the eye of apple. apple, which by the way tonight seems to be very afraid. for your attention. so we invented a warning you can feel. introducing the all-new cadillac xts. available with a patented safety alert seat. when there's danger you might not see,

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forget about the iphone 5. there could be a new apple product on the horizon, the ipad mini. the tech world is buzzing about this, that apple could be unveiling a smaller version of the ipad during an invitation only event, that's how they like to do it, at the end of the month. rumors has it the ipod mini will have a screen less than eight

inches and sell between $200 and $250 which would put it in the range of the kindle fire by amazon. the event is also going to be just a few days before microsoft's tablet comes into the market. there are a lot of these things competing which brings me to tonight's number, 13. that's the price of the texter beagle. texter says the beagle is the world's smallest ereader. it's lighter, its screen is five inches. it can only hold five books at a time, though. maybe apple is not so scared of the beagle. but you know what it is scared of, perhaps, is the samsung galaxy tab. that's been selling like hotcakes and its screen is only seven inches. maybe apple felt the need to rush into the smaller screen to try to steal samsung's business. let us know what you think. samsung, apple or beagle? let us know your favorite tablet on twitter or facebook.

from eric schmidt's google to reed hoffman, "outfront" has taken you behind the scenes of some of the world's most innovative ideas and most successful entrepreneurs. what sets tonight's idea apart from those we usually profile is what you're looking at right there. that's the young man we had on the show. he was 11 years old when he came up with his idea. not only that, but his idea caught the attention of one of the most revolutionary companies on the planet, apple. earlier, i spoke with charlie hutchison and asked him how he did it. >> well, i've always really been interested in computers and so when i decided to make an app i was thinking about what i would want to do and i decided i wanted an easy way to be able to follow all of my friends' accounts on flickr and see their photos. so that was the basic idea and then it kind of evolved from there. now it has a geocoded photos and recent photos but that was the

basic idea. >> so i have to be honest with you. a lot of people might say to me i have this idea, i really want to be able to follow my friend's pictures on flickr, they might have that idea, but i don't know anybody who could actually turn that into an app and make that work. how did you do that part of it? >> well, so i just -- i have always been interested in this so i did some -- used research to learn how to write the computer code to it and i just wrote about i think 2,000 lines of code and that made the app. >> wow. you just sat there and wrote the code. >> yes. >> all right. then when did you say i want apple -- i know my app is good enough to be on apple? how did you figure out how to go through the process? i got to imagine apple gets tens of thousands of people who want to have apps on every day. >> when i finally finished it and it was to my satisfaction, i thought it was ready, i looked it up and started looking at their developer programs and how you would submit it, and i finally submitted it to the app store so they could review it

and try to approve it for the app store. >> you were how old at that time? >> i was 11. i was going to turn 12 in a few days. >> okay. so some people might say to you hey, here you are, you're 12 1/2 years old now, so this is ancient history, right? 18 months ago when you did this app. people might, they look at you and say you're going to be another bill gates, going to be another tim cook. >> that's a pretty aggressive comparison. i would certainly love to do something great like that and i'll try to do something like that, but that is a pretty big comparison. >> what do your friends at school think? >> they think it's really cool. they have been really supportive and they have thought it was really cool and have given me plenty of ideas. >> so what are you working on? what's the next app you're coming up with? >> well, i'm working on several new projects but i'm not really sure what i'm going to do yet so i'm not really sure of all the details and what my next app is going to be yet.

>> are you kind of, you sound like a ceo there sometimes. i ask are you going to buy a company and they're not really sure. you being coy or really not sure? >> i'm really not sure. i'm working on a few things. i haven't worked out all the details and found out exactly what i'm going to do yet. >> but in addition to apps my understanding is you have a part-time computer consulting service that you do, and you're saving all of the money that you earn to go to the apple developer conference? >> yes. i just help a lot of people with their computers, mainly learn how to use them and teach them and get it set up, and so i can go to the worldwide developer conference with apple hopefully next year. >> but there's an age limit, right? you going to make the cutoff? >> yes. i'll be 13 next year and that is the age limit. although this is the first year it was 13. it used to be 18. but they finally changed it because they're starting to realize younger people are becoming more interested in computers and